Archadian Empire (FF12) invades Hyrule (Zelda)

[Cpt Olimar]

This will be an alternate battle from this what if scenario:
http://www.factpile.com/what-ifthe-arch ... ed-hyrule/

However a few new rules to make this hopefully a bit more concrete.

1) No triforce wishing, and each triforce piece must stay with its original owner (courage-link, power-ganondorf, wisdom-zelda). Should one of these individuals die, the triforce piece is lost. However, all powers derived from the zelda goddesses are intact (for example, Link's shell "nayru's love" still is a defensive magic powered by the great goddess herself).

2) The Hyrule in this battle is loosely based off of a combination of A Link to the Past's Hyrule, and Ocarina of Time's Hyrule. For example, consider the armed forces of Hyrule in A Link to the Past, but also include OoT's zoras and overall layout (it IS the 3-D incarnation of Hyrule after all)

3) The Arcadian empire does not have the Sky Fortress Bahamut.

4) The Arcadian empire is invading because of a valuable resource located in Hyrule which allows them to manufacture more magicite. This invasion is solely based on economics, should the battle become an economic toll the Archadians will cease. The Hyrulians are initially ignorant of this fact. The arcadians are ignorant of precisely where this resource is, and will be careful to avoid damaging it. Their initial strategy is an occupation.

5) Link is a single incarnation from a game. You may choose either AlttP, OoT or MM but no combining abilities from these. (I.E. no chateau Romani and Nayru's Love etc.)

So... what would happen? Would Archadia bother reinforcing its initial invasion to ensure access to this new resource? Or would Hyrule be able to repel them and push them out?

[Darkbladex96]

well id have to say that Arcadia still takes this. they are just too massive of a miltary force. even without bahamut they still have plenty of airships which gives them air superiority.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J2ahdyX2rVQ

plus the heros of hyrule can only be in one place at a time, and anyone of the judges can match swords with the like of link.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NL9KZT-8 ... re=related

these guys are no pushovers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svKWT-kmiqQ

Gabranth seemed easy because he was over leveled, for solo run, but take him out of game mechanics, Gabranth has a buff that negates about 50% of melee attacks on him. he also has an attack that fills the area with explosive force

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_uN1O_kToI
and alot of wide area AoE attacks

Bergan is the magic judge for the most part, capble of inflicting status ailments such as blind, and using multiple black magics
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7vnmk1v ... re=related

the judge act as generals so they will be very active.. heres the info on them.

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Judge_Bergan_(Boss)
bergan gets stronger as hes die if some starts to win against him, he spells cost 0, meaning spam, and his magicks allow him to ignore you defenses.

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Gabr ... y_XII_Boss)
Gabranth is a melee heavy hitter, fast as shit(always hasted, and protected), immune to time powers, can completely heal himself from any level of injury(assuming hes not to injured to cast renew), cant be stumbled.

Ghis isnt that powerful

but the empire has automotons and plenty of firepower to make hyrule say uncle.

[Shy Guy]

Gabranth seemed easy because he was over leveled, for solo run, but take him out of game mechanics, Gabranth has a buff that negates about 50% of melee attacks on him. he also has an attack that fills the area with explosive force

and alot of wide area AoE attacks

Bergan is the magic judge for the most part, capble of inflicting status ailments such as blind, and using multiple black magics

the judge act as generals so they will be very active.. heres the info on them.

bergan gets stronger as hes die if some starts to win against him, he spells cost 0, meaning spam, and his magicks allow him to ignore you defenses.

Gabranth is a melee heavy hitter, fast as shit(always hasted, and protected), immune to time powers, can completely heal himself from any level of injury(assuming hes not to injured to cast renew), cant be stumbled.

I agree with the air forces, but most everything you've stated here are just pieces of game mechanic information. I would say they have strong magic mastery, but I wouldn't say "He blocks 50% of all melee," just because it's in the game to increase difficulty, and they're hardly on par with the weapons mastery of Link's caliber, especially with the Triforce of Courage.

~Shy Guy

[Darkbladex96]

Gabranth seemed easy because he was over leveled, for solo run, but take him out of game mechanics, Gabranth has a buff that negates about 50% of melee attacks on him. he also has an attack that fills the area with explosive force

and alot of wide area AoE attacks

Bergan is the magic judge for the most part, capble of inflicting status ailments such as blind, and using multiple black magics

the judge act as generals so they will be very active.. heres the info on them.

bergan gets stronger as hes die if some starts to win against him, he spells cost 0, meaning spam, and his magicks allow him to ignore you defenses.

Gabranth is a melee heavy hitter, fast as shit(always hasted, and protected), immune to time powers, can completely heal himself from any level of injury(assuming hes not to injured to cast renew), cant be stumbled.

I agree with the air forces, but most everything you've stated here are just pieces of game mechanic information. I would say they have strong magic mastery, but I wouldn't say "He blocks 50% of all melee," just because it's in the game to increase difficulty, and they're hardly on par with the weapons mastery of Link's caliber, especially with the Triforce of Courage.
~Shy Guy

indeed there is a difference between GMs and actuallity, however you cant disregard ABILITIES and BUFFS, Gabraths blocks 50% of meele attacks because its an innate buff added to his natural skill, the same way a ribbon stops all status ailments(unless you dont agree with that). he immune to many effects either thru training and skill in how to counteract the skills or simply thru the items given to him buy acardia. like is a swordsman of great skill, but just to say HEZ BETTERZ DE TEH JUDGES, doesnt cut it. you have to put up proof. and i hope do dont mean to say that Gabranth cant make explosions with the swing of a sword? thats one of his moves.

as for bergan, hes the mage, no surprise that hes immune to most magic effects, and spell casting costing 0 and having 0 CT, taken out of gameplay simply means he can spam all day without fatiguing, with no break between spells. and with the opponent going blind everytime bergan touches them their arent many people who want to go toe to toe with him.

As an RPG FF12 has buffs, these are buffs that they themselves cast and envoke, if you dispel them they put them back on, or you just cant remove them at all. to claim they didnt have them would be to deny them a part of thier moves and powers. the same arguement could be used against links invincibility, nothing is indestructable yet there are spells and armor that do it. unless you want to say those are just their to make it easy for the player and it doesnt actually work like that.

[Cpt Olimar]

You do realize that the fact that he blocks 50% opposed to 50.1% or 49.9% or 10% is a gameplay mechanic and is ignored....

All RPG in-game statistics are ignored because they are balanced to make gameplay fun. As Shy said, the fact that he can block attacks should be considered into his overall skill, but the precise number is not canon, it's balanced for gameplay sake.

While Spells should be considered, the actual statistics on the buff are balanced for gameplay purposes and are not useful for out-of-game determination. Casting "blind" would probably have varying effects on different people, not a straight up percentage (i.e. on less skilled warriors, it would be a more devastating accuracy destroyer than on a more skilled and acute warrior).

Hopefully this issue can be cleared up and will not dominate the scope of this topic. To differentiate "gameplay mechanics" and "canon abilities" think to yourself that if the specifics you are arguing might have been adjusted if the developers wanted a harder or easier game, if the answer is yes, then that exact number is inconsequential.

However, absolute percentages often reflect game canon (i.e. 0% and 100% figures). For example, when the rooks protect Cid in the first battle against Cid, they bestow a powerful protective shield that guarded him from any physical or magical attack you possessed. While one should avoid a statement that goes against the no-limits-fallacy, one should also observe that the rooks didn't let any harm occur to him. This is much more than a game mechanic. The same thing could be said about Nayru's Love spell for Link. Even Ganondorf's strongest blows were simply inconsequential. The shield protected Link from anything in the game beyond game mechanic deaths/falls etc.

All this said, the Archadian empires strengths lie not with their judges, but with their common troops and the numbers they can field in battle.

[Darkbladex96]

i am sensing a misunderstand......i am not arguing RPG numbers and percentages, i am argueing for the buffs and abilities.

Gabranth has an ability that allows him to defend himself better in Melee combat then he could under his ouwn abilites, you cannot deny this buff, how effective it is game mechnics for the purpose you speak. but ts is a buff/enchantment so it is in play. Gabranth has a buff that allows him to attack without fatigue, this is in play, the bit about Atack CT, is not that is mechanic. this is what i argue, i argue that the abilities are in play but the numerical values dont count.

immunities are in play they are part of the characters abilities. and seeing how the judges are in fact generals in a magic army i see no reason not to believe they are able to defend against magic effects, obviously not every effect but i do know what their resistances are.

spells are considered and ive taken them outside of gameplay and this is where we disagree. blind will blind you, death will kill you, stop will stop you, and poison will poison you unless you have some sort of defense against magic or understanding of how to undo magic effects. period. being a skilled warrior doesnt help you be less blind, or less poisoned it helps you cope with it.

Arcadia's strength is numbers and troops but the Judges are a fundamental part of that as well. the judges inspire the soldiers and keeps thier moral high. in addition there are high commanders of each branch of military. they are the face of arcadia. they are very active in their duties so they will get alot of play. Gabranth is head of the ground forces i believe expect to see him at every major battle, Zaragabaath is the head of the "airforce" expect him to be in play during a raids.....etc.

also if take into account the people...morality plays a big part.(imagine if say Gabranth defeats and captures Link) the hylian people will be devastated. theyd start losing will to fight, same with zelda, or any other hero should they fall in battle. or what if they decide to start laying waste to the land until the power players decide to come fourth? more loss of moral.

either the people think the link, and crew dont care about them, thats why they keep letting the arcadians rampage.
or link shows himself and is killed by Arcadians forces.

also i was setting fourth not the fact that the judges were the biggest threat because like link Ganon, zelda, they can only be in one place. but they are the power players and when the hylians see a judge theyd better hope thier respective hero is around.

BTW...was it ever decided which link we are using? if not i suggest either OoT link or TP link since its easier to image them in a 3-D hyrule. im surpised no judge has a match on FP.

and why did you feel this need to have an alternative battle.

but all i have to say it that hyrule is lucky they arent fighting all of ivalice.