FACTPILE IS BACK!!!
CLICK HERE TO SEE FOR YOURSELF
Take a Tour of the Admin's Mancave

Goku vs Hulk

This is where you will debate until the main site comes back online.

Moderators: Forum Moderators, Authors

Goku vs Hulk

Postby guardianangel1911 » Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:04 am

Image
(suggested by Polloko)

Goku VS. Hulk.
-
Round 1. Canon Feats
Round 2. Composite
-
Who Wins?
"Fuck subtle."
Image

Image
User avatar
guardianangel1911
Voice of the People
 
Posts: 8508
Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2011 12:42 am

Re: Goku vs Hulk

Postby Friendlysociopath » Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:54 am

Well, Goku in Super is currently tangoing with guys who are actively stated to be lightspeed and above, while fighting and destroying an arena specifically made to withstand the energies of casual planetbusting, and thanks to Ultra Instinct he now basically has a flat zero for reaction times since his body will react by itself without conscious thought.

And to boot- he's already had a canon instance of deciding to BFR an opponent that he doesn't want to cause too much destruction. He'll fight the Hulk for a good long while, but if Hulk gets angry enough to start causing collateral damage, Goku's IT-ing him to a desolate moon or something.
User avatar
Friendlysociopath
Voice of the People
 
Posts: 4772
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2014 2:24 pm

Re: Goku vs Hulk

Postby CH1C4N0444 » Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:50 am

Round 1 could go either way, depending on which Hulk you go with (Cho or Banner)

Round 2 Hulk stomps. The guy has some out there power ups, but also would like some clarification on what you mean by composite. By composite Hulk do you mean anyone who has ever been a Hulk (i.e. Ross, Betty, Multiversal versions of a version of Bruce, etc)? Anyone who has ever been Bruce Banner/Cho from across the multiverse (one version of Bruce became Spiderman or Maestro Hulk for example)?

Some of the random ass crazy powers Hulk has had in the past or multiversal versions of himeslf include:
Nul's Hammer
Captain Universe
Rulk merging with him
Amped from Celestial Tech
Being a Zombie
Being Spiderman
Being a Zombie Galactus
Being a four armed monster that jumps from planet to planet that was comparable to that universes version of Galactus
having a nuclear death aura that melted lead and human flesh from being too close (this has happened like 3 times by the way)
having the power cosmic
and has been turned into a dinosaur hulk after being a spider hulk during Secret Wars I believe.
Image
Image
User avatar
CH1C4N0444
I Am the Highway
 
Posts: 562
Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:23 pm

Re: Goku vs Hulk

Postby Polloloko » Mon Feb 12, 2018 8:50 am

Well, Goku in Super is currently tangoing with guys who are actively stated to be lightspeed and above, while fighting and destroying an arena specifically made to withstand the energies of casual planetbusting, and thanks to Ultra Instinct he now basically has a flat zero for reaction times since his body will react by itself without conscious thought.


Hulk Stalemated a serious Sentry = https://m.imgur.com/a/C31HP

Have been stated that can destroy the Universe from just brute force alone = https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... -28568.jpg

Hulk's healing factor can regenerate near instantly = https://m.imgur.com/ubIAutK

And have keep up in speed with people like Thor, Silver Surfer, Sentry etc. ( Thats Massive Faster Than Light ), obviously is Reaction & Combat Speed = https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... -26155.jpg but not Travel speed, while Hulk isnt slow ether due him bieng able to blitz = https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... 12-hs3.jpg

Thats all for Hulk, he is not weak, he is Planet Level to Solar Sistem Level in his Peak, at Max he is Universe Level+, in speed he is Massive Hypersonic in Travel speed with Massive FTL+ Combat & Reaction Speed.

By composite Hulk do you mean anyone who has ever been a Hulk


By Composite, I have in mind, All Canon versions of Hulk into one ( Like for example, 616 + Ultimate + MCU + EMH etc etc etc. ) If that disnt work, then Composite Bruce Banned ( Hulk ).
Polloloko
Labled Incurable
 
Posts: 1002
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2016 9:02 pm

Re: Goku vs Hulk

Postby CH1C4N0444 » Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:54 pm

Friendlysociopath wrote:Well, Goku in Super is currently tangoing with guys who are actively stated to be lightspeed and above, while fighting and destroying an arena specifically made to withstand the energies of casual planetbusting, and thanks to Ultra Instinct he now basically has a flat zero for reaction times since his body will react by itself without conscious thought.

And to boot- he's already had a canon instance of deciding to BFR an opponent that he doesn't want to cause too much destruction. He'll fight the Hulk for a good long while, but if Hulk gets angry enough to start causing collateral damage, Goku's IT-ing him to a desolate moon or something.
I think the key thing to the first is that they're stated to be a certain speed. We don't ever get any actual proof that they even are. Even if that was the case, the only reason Goku was ever able to keep up with Dypso was because he fought very linearly and could just predict when and where he'd be, it wasn't because he could actually keep up with him. Hell, Gohan needed Frieza to lock him in a cage where he couldn't move around because of how much faster than everyone else Dypso was.

And no, the arena isn't specifically said to be capable of withstanding that type of energy, it's the hardest material in the multiverse, but never stated to be that durable (which honestly it probably wouldn't be since hard and tough materials aren't the same thing and hard things tend to be more brittle and easier to break). At the strongest, you could say it's comparable to graphene. Also, the more material you use the weaker it gets which is particularly worth noting when it comes to a giant arena made of one material. I believe this is called The Hall-Petch Relationship.

While Ultra Instinct would allow Goku to not have to react to Hulk it's still limited to whether or not he can move his body fast enough to evade, block, or counter.

Fighting Hulk in a battle of attrition is a bad idea, unless your somebody like Doomsday or Asura who play his game but are better at it. If Goku decides to keep fighting Hulk he will loose. Goku is a glass cannon, despite how allegedly these characters are capable of withstanding enough energy to destroy planets and whatnot Goku needs a special suit to survive the pressures of Earth's core (which means durability wise he can't withstand 360 GPa worth of pressure), every character ever always craps themselves whenever anybody mentions the planet being destroyed (Vegeta even dies in SSB with every other character, except probably Buu, when Frieza blows up the Earth and he wasn't in space long enough for me to assume he suffocated or froze to death).

Polloloko wrote:By Composite, I have in mind, All Canon versions of Hulk into one ( Like for example, 616 + Ultimate + MCU + EMH etc etc etc. ) If that disnt work, then Composite Bruce Banned ( Hulk ).
OK, well, Hulk stomps round 2.

Space Hulk killed the Watchers who literally held the universe together
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Likoc54fCf4/W ... RCO013.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-ZARye23u-yg/W ... RCO019.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Hj__qp18W0Q/W ... RCO022.jpg

Space Hulk was the biggest threat since Galactus and the guy routinely jumps between planets.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-UjX-R4gmu2I/W ... RCO004.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-nazgiFVT1nw/W ... RCO010.jpg

World Breaker Hulk is a Herald of Galactus and would have all the powers of guys like Silver Surfer, so things like turning people into black holes, making stars, being able to sundip, absorbing energy etc.
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... aker-l.jpg

Superman comments that Hulk is fast and that he's stronger than anyone he's ever fought. Notice how he launches Supes near a star.
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-1F0yh1m0Sck/ ... supes2.jpg

Presumably the strongest version of Hulk, Captain Universe Hulk
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... _super.jpg

Deadpool once held the Unipower and he was matching Thanos who was beating up the physical manifestation of the universe.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/9Q63DhuJwUmrZM ... qqaW=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/vXNZ8nRmglgkPw ... I-Oh=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/5ys6T_gjubU4eP ... WueA=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/VZ3ua2Jic-p9L0 ... rYKD=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/wKQKN4iVNRU_17 ... SgDS=s1600

Sue Richards had the power and matched Gladiator
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/Vc8Rv8oL4cUZHl ... nMlQ=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/svVUz4EoMefJsM ... mZsw=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/qIegpePKeADzmG ... _Ozw=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/4v0o5f4NvIx0KO ... tF5w=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/iHBVqxMXylLxoG ... gaGQ=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/doEERu08lM92SB ... NcKw=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/1X0E5-4EDIJSUu ... 4dqA=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/tLt5OYZLdiV7JU ... u3Pw=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/p32uYc_Ys41Fzb ... gzSA=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/iHhIDO2AmjnCgP ... So7A=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/eY8cmoopOUAh4P ... AUDQ=s1600

amara with Captain Universe powers tanks an explosion that seemingly snuffed out multiple stars. Although it knocks her out.
https://imgur.com/a/68UOG

You get the picture, Captain Universe Hulk is powerful as shit.

Hulk was merged with Rulk, This is dangerous for a guy like Goku, why? Because Rulk has absorbed the power cosmic from Silver Surfer and Terrax. The more energy he absorbs the stronger he gets.
https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-3 ... 6d5a1756-c
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-o6VgHolbIXQ/V ... 0/p7_3.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... ulk_09.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/08/9a/6a ... 00357c.jpg

There are versions of Hulk that the only feats they have are taking on multiple Hulks at once, like Devil Hulk having to be restrained by Joe Fixit and Savage Hulk
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... ulkAlt.jpg

Hulk has "meltdown" modes that have boiled oceans
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-ihAl6_fZqX0/V ... /76_09.jpg
Melted down a nuclear contaiment unit.
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... 46_16a.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... 46_16b.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... 46_17a.jpg
Less impressive, but he also melts lead and peoples faces from getting too close to him
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... 281%29.png
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... 282%29.png
And just destroys the area around him
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... ltdown.png

Doc Green was also taught by IF, who is one of the best martial artists in the Marvel Universe
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... age-17.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... int2-2.jpg

Chulk took down Odinson without going World Breaker, meanwhile Odinson was physically forced to go all out and break the world. Literally, the guys controlling Odinson wanted him to destroy the planet.
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-4GSYp_G-6qc/ ... 3_0002.jpg
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-SWVoZhPAoPk/ ... 3_0003.jpg
https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-CIUWzjv4JRQ/ ... 3_0004.jpg
https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-gfGu2IWRwZI/ ... 3_0005.jpg
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-n_LK7fmGr_A/ ... 3_0007.jpg
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-op8oZ_mL4Ak/ ... 3_0008.jpg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-nWhUGDMIrks/ ... 3_0009.jpg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-5nXpICxQN6w/ ... 3_0013.jpg
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-NbnaXfcnQUg/ ... 3_0014.jpg
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-ovD46Wg7sME/ ... 3_0015.jpg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Kf6qWJzJ-Lc/ ... 3_0016.jpg
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-LHEKaU1T6-Y/ ... 3_0017.jpg

Anyways, maybe post more later on, maybe not.
Image
Image
User avatar
CH1C4N0444
I Am the Highway
 
Posts: 562
Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:23 pm

Re: Goku vs Hulk

Postby Friendlysociopath » Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:48 pm

CH1C4N0444 wrote:I think the key thing to the first is that they're stated to be a certain speed. We don't ever get any actual proof that they even are. Even if that was the case, the only reason Goku was ever able to keep up with Dypso was because he fought very linearly and could just predict when and where he'd be, it wasn't because he could actually keep up with him. Hell, Gohan needed Frieza to lock him in a cage where he couldn't move around because of how much faster than everyone else Dypso was.


They were not stated to be a 'certain speed'. We were given two separate lines of dialogue, that Dypso could exceed the speed of light and later that Dypso could multiply his speed thousands of times. Given that the latter statement was later IIRC, we presumably have them battling at greater than lightspeed.
And there is no given way for there to be 'actual proof' unless you do something like race a laser or something- which comes across as silly. There's actually a fairly recent RWBY clip where we specifically get to see Weiss swinging her sword while racing a bullet of Ruby's- and it looks silly and contrived as hell because Ruby had to accidentally fire her weapon past Weiss so she could 'race it' with her sword.



CH1C4N0444 wrote:And no, the arena isn't specifically said to be capable of withstanding that type of energy, it's the hardest material in the multiverse, but never stated to be that durable (which honestly it probably wouldn't be since hard and tough materials aren't the same thing and hard things tend to be more brittle and easier to break). At the strongest, you could say it's comparable to graphene. Also, the more material you use the weaker it gets which is particularly worth noting when it comes to a giant arena made of one material. I believe this is called The Hall-Petch Relationship.


The material was specifically made so that the Gods of Destruction would not blast the field to nothing when fighting in earnest. Beerus with almost no effort at all can planetbust. The relationship there is pretty easy to make out. Also given that it's a fictional material I don't see how you could make a judgement on hardness vs toughness.


CH1C4N0444 wrote:While Ultra Instinct would allow Goku to not have to react to Hulk it's still limited to whether or not he can move his body fast enough to evade, block, or counter.

Fighting Hulk in a battle of attrition is a bad idea, unless your somebody like Doomsday or Asura who play his game but are better at it. If Goku decides to keep fighting Hulk he will loose. Goku is a glass cannon, despite how allegedly these characters are capable of withstanding enough energy to destroy planets and whatnot Goku needs a special suit to survive the pressures of Earth's core (which means durability wise he can't withstand 360 GPa worth of pressure), every character ever always craps themselves whenever anybody mentions the planet being destroyed (Vegeta even dies in SSB with every other character, except probably Buu, when Frieza blows up the Earth and he wasn't in space long enough for me to assume he suffocated or froze to death).



I believe it was the heat of Earth's core, though I will admit that I only briefly saw that episode.
Also their durability is based on their ki shields, which are repeatedly stated to be lower when they're surprised. Not saying you're wrong, just that Akira has given himself plenty of loopholes for pretty much any DBZ argument at this point. If you don't allow scaling or various other factors- Goku is no stronger nor faster in Super than he was before because every feat gets shot down into non-existence.
User avatar
Friendlysociopath
Voice of the People
 
Posts: 4772
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2014 2:24 pm

Re: Goku vs Hulk

Postby hellboy147 » Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:32 pm

Have been stated that can destroy the Universe from just brute force alone = https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/or ... -28568.jpg

In that case Goku will be Universal+ level. He shook the entire world of void by transforming to Ultra Instinct alone which is infinite in size: https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/vsb ... 1008040910
https://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/vs ... 0212031816
hellboy147
FactPiler
 
Posts: 183
Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:48 pm

Re: Goku vs Hulk

Postby Friendlysociopath » Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:49 pm

Granted, I do agree Goku will likely lose, he has an opponent that will constantly keep powering up to provide a challenge and Goku won't be tossing that aside lightly.
User avatar
Friendlysociopath
Voice of the People
 
Posts: 4772
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2014 2:24 pm

Re: Goku vs Hulk

Postby hellboy147 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:14 pm

Granted, I do agree Goku will likely lose, he has an opponent that will constantly keep powering up to provide a challenge and Goku won't be tossing that aside lightly.

Debatable, Goku can take hell a lot of beating as well and he kept coming back in the past. Frieza, Beerus and Jiren all beat the living crap out of him at one point. All these fighters are easily capable of more than just busting a planet. Speaking of Jiren, he is in the league of his own right now if you are watching Dragonball super. Hulk is beatable by physical strikes as well; Zeus destroyed him at one point in marvel. Goku as a fighter is a lot smarter than Hulk, one well timed Kamehameha at full force might be the end of Hulk.
hellboy147
FactPiler
 
Posts: 183
Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:48 pm

Re: Goku vs Hulk

Postby Friendlysociopath » Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:40 pm

hellboy147 wrote:
Granted, I do agree Goku will likely lose, he has an opponent that will constantly keep powering up to provide a challenge and Goku won't be tossing that aside lightly.

Debatable, Goku can take hell a lot of beating as well and he kept coming back in the past. Frieza, Beerus and Jiren all beat the living crap out of him at one point. All these fighters are easily capable of more than just busting a planet. Speaking of Jiren, he is in the league of his own right now if you are watching Dragonball super. Hulk is beatable by physical strikes as well; Zeus destroyed him at one point in marvel. Goku as a fighter is a lot smarter than Hulk, one well timed Kamehameha at full force might be the end of Hulk.


The last bit is a pretty potent point (not to say the rest isn't but the Kamehameha does bring up a specific one) Hulk does not fly, correct? In which case he isn't like DBZ characters where he can magically just move himself in a direction to counter incoming force. If Goku pulls the same trick he did on Cell, Hulk is presumably going flying and probably won't be coming back from it.
User avatar
Friendlysociopath
Voice of the People
 
Posts: 4772
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2014 2:24 pm

Next

Return to Factpile Debates

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest